Comments on: Random Things, Revisited http://www.juliandibbell.com/2009/02/17/random-things-revisited/ (dot com) Sat, 31 Jul 2010 11:49:11 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: juliandibbell http://www.juliandibbell.com/2009/02/17/random-things-revisited/comment-page-1/#comment-19 juliandibbell Wed, 18 Feb 2009 15:40:14 +0000 http://www.juliandibbell.com/?p=100#comment-19 I like Burroughs on this too, if only because, again, I'll still take "Language is a virus from outer space" over "Language is spreadable and made by humans, somewhat like Nutella." But above all it's the "outer space" part I like, because if I understand Burroughs's version of the metaphor (and I suppose maybe Dawkins's), the meme truly is "utterly alien" and self-implanting -- not engineered by other humans and/or corporations to control our minds, as in the fantasies of marketers and the nightmares of Rushkoffs. So yes, web memes, like language, can be kind of perverse and counterproductive in their hold on our consciousness, though I suspect their perversity and counterproductivity are of a piece with our condition as social animals, and could probably be found at least incipiently in monkey troops. The ambivalence we feel about memes, in other words, is just a metastasized version of the ambivalence we feel about other people generally. All this to say, I guess, that I may be less of a humanist on this subject than Jenkins (you taught me well, Prof. Shaviro!). What he and I do share though, I think, is a pretty severe allergy to anyone -- whether they are self-appointed arbiters of the social good or marketers on the make -- who presumes to write off as mindless dupes the people who shape, spread, and wrest meaning from memes. I like Burroughs on this too, if only because, again, I’ll still take “Language is a virus from outer space” over “Language is spreadable and made by humans, somewhat like Nutella.” But above all it’s the “outer space” part I like, because if I understand Burroughs’s version of the metaphor (and I suppose maybe Dawkins’s), the meme truly is “utterly alien” and self-implanting — not engineered by other humans and/or corporations to control our minds, as in the fantasies of marketers and the nightmares of Rushkoffs. So yes, web memes, like language, can be kind of perverse and counterproductive in their hold on our consciousness, though I suspect their perversity and counterproductivity are of a piece with our condition as social animals, and could probably be found at least incipiently in monkey troops. The ambivalence we feel about memes, in other words, is just a metastasized version of the ambivalence we feel about other people generally.

All this to say, I guess, that I may be less of a humanist on this subject than Jenkins (you taught me well, Prof. Shaviro!). What he and I do share though, I think, is a pretty severe allergy to anyone — whether they are self-appointed arbiters of the social good or marketers on the make — who presumes to write off as mindless dupes the people who shape, spread, and wrest meaning from memes.

]]> By: Steven Shaviro http://www.juliandibbell.com/2009/02/17/random-things-revisited/comment-page-1/#comment-17 Steven Shaviro Wed, 18 Feb 2009 01:53:02 +0000 http://www.juliandibbell.com/?p=100#comment-17 Though I largely agree with you and Jenkins, the one thing I like about the metaphor of "memes" and "viral" media is the way it suggests the William Burroughs idea of desires, beliefs, etc. that get implanted in us despite being utterly alien to us and manipulating us to our own detriment. Though I largely agree with you and Jenkins, the one thing I like about the metaphor of “memes” and “viral” media is the way it suggests the William Burroughs idea of desires, beliefs, etc. that get implanted in us despite being utterly alien to us and manipulating us to our own detriment.

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